Host: We are pleased to be joined on set outside the history and biography room by former justice of the supreme court Sandra Day O'Connor. This is her fifth book, the history of the Supreme Court, "Out of Order." Five books. When did you discover you enjoyed writing?

Sandra Day O'Connor: nothing changed, lots of things to write about and tell about.

Host: would be doing at the book festival? You are not talking about your book.

Sandra Day O'Connor: not really. I know jim billington at the wall street -- my brother has a new book out. And so Jim told me I had to bring my brother so I said I would and that is why we are here.

Host: you are in conversation with alan. Your brother. What is his book about?

Sandra Day O'Connor: for a long time he had them in North Dakota where he could take these and keep them for a while. The federal government had the responsibility for them so he did that for quite a while. It was so simple. Host: let's talk about out of water and some of the stories year. One of the first stories you tell is former chief justice John Marshall and Thomas Jefferson were related and did not like each other.

Sandra Day O'Connor: isn't that amazing?

Host: was the relationship?

Sandra Day O'Connor: it was amazing that they didn't like each other and it was so difficult to manage but they did.

Host: the Marbury v. Madison case was during President Jefferson's tenure. Exactly what did that case establish?

Sandra Day O'Connor: I don't know that today we say much of anything.