Justice O'Connor

produced by

Bill Owens

Catherine Herrick

Scott Pelley Of all you've heard about Ronald Reagan, there is someone you haven't heard from. A person who has had almost as much impact on the history of our nation as the president himself. As a rule, Supreme Court justices don't give many interviews. But Justice Sandra Day O'Connor sat down with us to talk about the man who made her the the first woman on the Supreme Court. Since that day in 1981, Justice O'Connor has become one of the most powerful women in America. In the years since Reagan left office, O'Connor has been the deciding vote, laying down the law of the land on abortion, affirmative action and the decision that made George Bush, President of the United States. We sat down with Justice O'Connor at the Supreme Court, an institution that had seen only men on the bench for nearly two centuries until Ronald Reagan changed it forever.

Sandra Day O'Connor It had an incredible ripple effect, of making opportunities become available for women. It was, it was just a remarkable transformation. And I really think he deserves an enormous amount of credit for making that happen in this country.

Ronald Reagan I will send to the Senate, the nomination of Judge Sandra Day O'Connor, of Arizona Court of Appeals, for confirmation as an associate justice of the United States Supreme Court.

Scott Pelley Just six months in office, President Reagan made his first appointment to the court. And other than his work to end the Cold War, many believe that this was his greatest achievement. Why such a large transformation in your view? How did it change ever?

Sandra Day O'Connor Because a woman had never held a position at that level of our government. And it was a signal that it was all right, that women could be in such positions. That they could do well in such positions. And so opportunities at every level, not just for lawyers and judges, but across the spectrum, opened for women. It was wonderful.

Scott Pelley President Reagan used to say that the judges he appointed to federal courts would long outlive him. He brought three new justices to the Supreme Court, but he will be remembered most for adding the first woman here who wasn't made of stone.

Sandra Day O'Connor This is the commission that President Reagan signed, making my nomination and appointment to the Supreme Court of the United States.

Scott Pelley This is a very historic document…

Sandra Day O'Connor It is.

Scott Pelley And also women's rights…

Sandra Day O'Connor Indeed, it is.

Scott Pelley In the progress of women in this country.

Sandra Day O'Connor In deed it is.

Scott Pelley It will probably be in the national archive one day.

Sandra Day O'Connor Well, I, I… It could well be. It's on my wall right now where I am happy to have it.

Scott Pelley Sandra Day was raised on an Arizona cattle ranch. She got into Stanford University at the age of 16 and finished third in her class at Stanford Law. But even that couldn't get her a job in 1952. One big law firm told her they'd never hired a woman and had no plans to do so. Her first job was in a prosecutor's office, working for free. She continued to work hard, ultimately rising to become a state appeals court judge in Arizona. You were a state appellate court judge in Arizona.

Sandra Day O'Connor Yes.

Scott Pelley When Ronald Reagan, in his first campaign, announced that he would appoint a woman to the Supreme Court.

Sandra Day O'Connor Well, I think he said he'd like to appoint a qualified woman.

Scott Pelley And when you heard that, what did you think?

Sandra Day O'Connor Well, I thought that was a great idea. You know, it had been 191 years, since we became a country and no woman had ever been on the court. You know, it was still hard for woman to achieve success in our country at that time.

Scott Pelley Did you think it could be you?

Sandra Day O'Connor No, I didn't. I was very happy where I was. And it was not a job to which I aspired.

Scott Pelley Not a job to which you aspired?

Sandra Day O'Connor No.

Scott Pelley The Supreme Court of the United States?

Sandra Day O'Connor No, no. Because I had a very full life and happy one in Arizona. My family was there. My husband was a significant partner in a law firm that he loved. And everything was fine. Life was good.

Scott Pelley Then came the telephone call from President Reagan's attorney general asking you to come up for an interview.

Sandra Day O'Connor Yes, indeed, much to my surprise. One morning, the attorney general arranged appointments for me with a series of the president's close advisors. And each of them wanted to talk to me for a while about my background and experiences. And then, the attorney general asked if I could go by the Oval Office. And I said, "Fine. But where is it?" Uh, I was really not familiar with Washington, D.C. I had never been to the White House. I wasn't sure where to find it. And so, the attorney general arranged that his secretary would pick me up. And I stood on Dupont Circle and waited on the sidewalk along came Attorney General Smith's secretary in her green Chevrolet. And we made our way to the White House. And that was pretty exciting because, of course, I had never seen the Oval Office or anything in the White House.

Scott Pelley You walk into the Oval Office and there's President Reagan.

Sandra Day O'Connor President Reagan was such a gracious, warm, easy-going person with whom, to visit. There was no way that you could feel ill at ease in the presence, in the presence of President Reagan because he had the knack and the unfailing capacity to put people at ease.

Scott Pelley What did he want to know?

Sandra Day O'Connor Well, we did a little talk about ranching, actually, and horses and fence mending and cattle and so on. He was a westerner by that time, through and through, and he loved horses and riding. And he liked ranch life. And so, I think he was sort of intrigued with the fact that that had been my background.

Scott Pelley There must have been some conversation about where you stood on important issues of the day.

Sandra Day O'Connor Oh, to some extent.

Scott Pelley Abortion being one of them?

Sandra Day O'Connor Not really. The conversation was pretty general. And I think he knew that his advisors would have read opinions of mine and explored my background in full, which I am sure they had.

Scott Pelley It was the only interview President Reagan needed. He knew he had the court's first lady. But O'Connor was sure that she had seen the Oval Office for the first and last time.

Sandra Day O'Connor And I took an airplane back to Arizona that afternoon. And I remember sitting on the airplane and thinking what a remarkable visit it had been, and how amazing it was to be in the White House, to have conversed with the president, to have met his close advisors, to have been in the Oval Office. And I said to myself, "Thank goodness, I don't have to go to do that job."

Scott Pelley You felt that you weren't qualified to take the job?

Sandra Day O'Connor Well, I didn't know if I was qualified. I hadn't been tested.

Scott Pelley You get tested for this job the hard way.

Sandra Day O'Connor The hard way, by doing it.

Scott Pelley You got back to Arizona and back to your State appellate court offices.

Sandra Day O'Connor Yes, and I hadn't been there more than a week when the telephone rang and it was President Reagan saying he'd like to announce my nomination for the court the next day, and that, he thought it might help if he sent someone out to help with the press. I think this isn't a very good time for an interview.

Scott Pelley Well, she might have used some pointers on the press. Justice O'Connor told us that it was her sense of confidence that really needed the help.

Sandra Day O'Connor Yes, and I was concerned and worried because it's such a huge responsibility. And I've often said that it's great to be the first. But you don't want to be the last. And if I didn't do it well, it might be. It would have not have served the cause of enhancement of opportunities for women well, to take a job that I couldn't fulfill well.

Scott Pelley Today, she's the third longest serving member on the court.

Charles Cooper She was the most important single appointment made to the, to the Federal bench by President Reagan.

Scott Pelley Charles Cooper was a Reagan administration official who helped screen the Supreme Court nominees.

Charles Cooper It is hard to exaggerate her role on the court, or her importance to the court's decision, decision making in one case after another, at least one controversial case after another. The essential swing or deciding vote is generally recognized to be Justice O'Connor's.

Scott Pelley About 80% of the time, Justice O'Connor votes with the conservatives, but on some controversial issues she has stood well to the left of President Reagan.

Charles Cooper Some of her votes, in particular, I would say, some recent ones from this past term, would have disappointed President Reagan, yes.

Scott Pelley She's gone her own way.

Charles Cooper She has indeed. She has indeed.

Scott Pelley Supreme Court justices never speak publicly about their deliberations or their decisions, but we did wonder about some of Justice O'Connor's votes that might have surprised the man who appointed her. You have cast deciding votes in many, many including cases, cases that were decided 5 to 4, including cases that have upheld a woman's right to choose, right to abortion, also upholding affirmative action in our universities. What do you think President Reagan would think of those decisions that some might call moderate and others might even call liberal?

Sandra Day O'Connor Well, I don't know. I wish I did. He was a remarkable president, and he understood the country well. And I like to think that he would have understood that as well. I don't know.

Scott Pelley Do you think you became the justice that he wanted you to be?

Sandra Day O'Connor I don't know. I hope so.

Scott Pelley Where do you place yourself in Ronald Reagan's legacy?

Sandra Day O'Connor Well, I just see the appointment of a woman to this court as a door opener for women across our land. And I think that's an incredible legacy.

Scott Pelley Sandra Day O'Connor is expected to be the only member of the Supreme Court to speak at the president's funeral on Friday.